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Re: [ddlm-group] Space as a list item separator

Given that allowing comma + space permits [1,2, 3 4] I will vote
for space only.  While this moves away from familiar syntax in
other languages, Python for instance would not allow the above
mixed case.

John


James Hester wrote:
> Herbert writes:
> 
> "I thought you had your vote and had decided not to support commas in
> lists, but if it is still being discussed ..."
> 
> I have been holding off on a final declaration, given that the vote 
> wasn't that definitive and John hasn't yet contributed. But, unless 
> Brian and John both move to the commas + spaces option, the choice of 
> this group is that spaces only can be used as a list item separator.  
> That will be the syntax that we will move forward with.
> 
> Herbert: keep your current software versions around somewhere, because 
> until COMCIFS formally puts the big tick in the box, the standard is not 
> set in stone.
> 
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 10:24 AM, Herbert J. Bernstein 
> <yaya@bernstein-plus-sons.com <mailto:yaya@bernstein-plus-sons.com>> wrote:
> 
>     I am very sorry to hear that.  In my shop, dealing with this one
>     change will involve 1-3 person-months of recoding to make commas
>     optional and
>     to introduce warning messages when they are encountered and in
>     redoing dictionaries and test cases.  What a pointless waste.  I
>     hope this
>     group will complete its work in the near future, so we can have some
>     chance of having something stable to work against.
> 
> 
>     =====================================================
>      Herbert J. Bernstein, Professor of Computer Science
>       Dowling College, Kramer Science Center, KSC 121
>            Idle Hour Blvd, Oakdale, NY, 11769
> 
>                     +1-631-244-3035
>                     yaya@dowling.edu <mailto:yaya@dowling.edu>
>     =====================================================
> 
>     On Wed, 2 Dec 2009, James Hester wrote:
> 
>         Counting up the votes so far on the list delimiter question I get:
> 
>         Space and comma: David, Herbert
>         Space only: Simon, Nick, James, Joe (?)
>         Agnostic: Brian
>         Unknown: John
> 
>         It looks like the spaces have it, although I have perhaps
>         over-interpreted
>         Joe's reply.  
> 
>         On Wed, Dec 2, 2009 at 3:57 AM, David Brown <idbrown@mcmaster.ca
>         <mailto:idbrown@mcmaster.ca>> wrote:
>              MY VOTE IS FOR 1 (SPACE AND COMMA) because commas are better
>              visually.  Not a strong argument and I would not give my vote a
>              large weighting.  I can live with 2 as well.
> 
>              David
> 
>              James Hester wrote:
>         Dear CIF2 people: the time has come to vote on the list item
>         separator issue.  Firstly: as far as I know, nobody is against
>         space as a separator, so spaces will be possible list item
>         separators.  Some may be against commas, so this vote is on
>         whether or not to allow commas.
> 
>         To summarise the arguments:
> 
>         1. In favour of both space and comma
>            - comma is used in some other non-CIF contexts as a list
>         delimiter
> 
>         2. Against comma:
>            - A single type of separator makes the grammar simpler
>            - Space is used everywhere else in CIF as a separator
>         (consistency)
>            - Comma can then be used in non-delimited strings
> 
>         Space only: Nick, James (Nick is here)
>         Comma and Space: ?
> 
>         On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 5:30 PM, James Hester
>         <jamesrhester@gmail.com <mailto:jamesrhester@gmail.com>> wrote:
>              More specifically, CIF1.1 excludes square brackets
>              as the first character in a non-delimited string.
> 
>              On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 9:33 AM, James Hester
>              <jamesrhester@gmail.com <mailto:jamesrhester@gmail.com>> wrote:
>                    Dear Herbert: as CIF 1.1 doesn't define
>                    lists, I'm not sure why you suggest that
>                    the example below is a valid tag.
> 
>                    On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 12:36 AM, Herbert
>                    J. Bernstein
>                    <yaya@bernstein-plus-sons.com
>         <mailto:yaya@bernstein-plus-sons.com>> wrote:
>                          Sorry something got lost in
>                          the prior message.  It
>                          should have
>                          read:
> 
>                                Dear Colleagues,
> 
>                                 Back to the
>                                question of
>                                commas.  If you
>                                accept the
>                                desirability of
>                                having a CIF
>                                1.5, commas in
>                                lists become
>                                very useful.
>                                 Someone with
>                                a CIF 1.1 editor
>                                will be able to
>                                prepare a CIF
>                                1.5 file for
>                                many
>                                useful cases by
>                                doing all lists
>                                with commas and
>                                no embedded
>                                blanks
>                                as long as they
>                                can make their
>                                lists fit on
>                                single lines.
>                                 In CIF 1.1
> 
>                                [[1,2,3],[4,5,6],[7,8,9]]
> 
>                                is a valid value
>                                for a tag, but
> 
>                                [[1 2 3] [4 5 6]
>                                [7 8 9]]
> 
>         is not.
> 
> 
>         No, neither example is a valid CIF 1.1 tag.  CIF 1.1
>         explicitly excludes brackets as the first character
>         of a non-delimited string.
> 
> 
>                    Having the option of commas
>                    in lists will help to smooth
>                    the
>                    transition for at least some
>                    people.
> 
> 
> 
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